Fasting for Ramadan as a non-Muslim – The Make Up Day

hello Zac, been a while……thankyou  for your thoughtful reflections on the fasting experience.  Our experiences are unique to us and when we share them, it adds depth and color to all our lives. It is the same with all the wisdom teachings of the world, they add insight and perspective to our own traditions when shared. As the Quran says…if God had wanted us all to think and act the same…..he would have made us so….instead he gave us diversity.

outside the box—Personally, I think that is what most wisdom teachers, such as Lao Tzu, Buddha, Jesus Christ(pbuh), Prophet Muhammed(pbuh) etc tried to do….take the human experience “outside the box” to revitalize it from the spiritual stagnation that was happening in their times.

Grand narrative—whatever the name of ones faith, EGO does tend to distort the wisdom. It hapens in all the best traditions. no matter how much we try to avoid it, as human beings, we are all succeptible to the “we are better than them” attitude. The thing to remember is that wisdom will be veiled to us unless we approach it with an attitude of humility.

Christianity—As a Muslim, it would be impossible for me to not have respect for the teachings and wisdom of Jesus Christ (peace be upon him). Yet, it  seems to me that these teachings have become lost in the often convoluted and unfathomable doctrines of  the various Christianities…. or perhaps it is simply my own intellectual inadequacy….? Nevertheless, Christianity is a bit unique in its premise of “original sin” (everyone is born a sinner) and related assumptions—sin to be paid by sacrificse(crucifixion) and belief in this leads to (guarenteed)salvation.(heaven/paradise)…..or something close to it….this obsession with (guaranteed) salvation seems to be a particularly “Christian” phenomenon.  As a Muslim, I am not a “born sinner”, but I am also not guarenteed Paradise on the basis of belief alone—since faith/belief must be translated into intentions and actions. So my understanding of religion is that it is a “guide to life”—and a Jew, Buddhist, Daoist…etc are likely to say the same.

Atheist—I am slightly biased in favor of Atheists myself—because the ones I have chatted with have been spiritual seekers with a lively curiosity and a great sense of humor…which are essential if one is to explore life and wisdom……..otherwise one is seriously dull and ends up with ones intellect in sleep mode!

vacuum of nothingness—interesting phrase. very Eastern!! some might say you have advanced in the ladder of spirituality since one has to traverse from “worldiness” to “nothingness” before encountering “spirituality”

Anon – Good to hear from you again!

I like your thoughts on wisdom teachers continually thinking “outside the box” throughout their histories. This is possibly why Rob Bell has had such an impact in American Christianity over the past decade. Do you ever feel that 21st century Islam has become too boxed in?

My personal attempt to overcome the “us vs. them” tendencies is to categorize myself as “human” and work towards the inclusiveness that such a position requires. It’s not perfect at all, but it’s a framework that I find helpful.

It’s probably as difficult to understand a version of Christianity from the outside as it is to understand a version of Islam from the outside. 

If one believes that Islam is a religion of violent jihad (which many unfortunately do), then they will look to passages from the sacred texts to support this.

If one believes that Christianity is a religion of prosperity and blessings from God for those He has chosen to bless (which many unfortunately do), then they will look to passages from the sacred texts to support this as well.

That’s really what led me down this path of rejecting entire faith systems. As you said: “our experiences are unique to us”. It doesn’t seem that there is ever any official version of God’s plans and actions. We all just choose what makes the most sense to us, and hope that it is the “truth”.

As far as the spiritual ladder goes, I’m not sure where I would be slotted on that. I’ve never been very worldly, but I’d say I’m closer to that now than at any other point in my life. I had some form of spirituality earlier in life, but now it feels closer to nothingness.

diversity and unity in Islam—One could say that from the beginning, Islam(religion) is a kind of ”box”—though a very large one. The Quran defines a “believer” in many ways, one of the terms it uses is “muttaqeen” (one who has Taqwa–God-awareness)–this puts many people of many different belief systems into the “box” of believer. There is only one Arabic Quran for all 1.5 billion Muslims for all of 1400 years—-no versions, editions, revisions etc, with the 5 pillars this does create a kind of unity not seen in Christianity. On the other hand, Islam brought reform to the socio-economic and geo-political system of the time (enlightenment in a time of uncivility) and reform usually means going “outside the box”(status quo). Which is why the experience of a Muslim living in Turkey would be different from the one in Saudi Arabia to that of one living in Indonesia—etc.    In my opinion, it is this spirit which makes a religion “alive” as opposed to stagnant. In that sense, I would say that Islam has been in a period of stagnation for a while. (I am not speaking of religion in terms of its rituals—but more as spiritual guidance based on ethico-moral principles)

“If one believes that Islam is a religion of violent jihad (which many unfortunately do), then they will look to passages from the sacred texts to support this.”
—-On the surface, there may seem nothing wrong with this statement—it seems to be a good explanation. But I have some doubts about it. First, I mentioned that the (Arabic) Quran is the exact same text. There are no versions where some Quran are more violent than others (we are not speaking of translations here). 2ndly, the Quran itself says it is a book to be read as a whole and passages must not be “cut up for profit”(to advance an agenda) and when looked at as a whole, then the Quran repeatedly warns defending soldiers not to transgress limits in their battles. 3rd, if the terrorists—such as those of 9/11 were non-Arabic speaking Muslims relying on translated understanding—that would be one thing—but many are Arabic speakers—-therefore to use Quranic justification for terrorist violence would actually be to deliberately go AGAINST the Quran—not to mention, falsify the message of the Quran as well. —so while I may not completely discount the statement—I think that it may be too simplified.
While it may perhaps be easier for Christians to rely directly on their sacred texts for various justifications, it might work to remember that both Judaism and Islam are legalistic and complex traditions with a large body of work outside of their (primary) sacred texts.

I agree with you that the best “religion” is whichever makes you the better human being—for some it may be Christianity—for others it may be something else—whatever works. The thing to remember is that the wisdom teachers who brought the message and guidance did so to uplift the human spirit to achive its great potential—we can honor our various traditions by striving to be the best of humanity.

If he’s the leader then it should be looked at negatively as he used his position of power and deceived and abused people with it. He may have done *some* good and those he did help will no doubt be grateful, but he himself isn’t someone to look at positively.

However with the church and the abuse by the clergy, I don’t think it’s fair to thing wrongly about every clergyman because of a few.

I don’t understand how this is linked to not cutting up the Qur’an :S or was this example just for judging all ‘versions’ of Islam and the actions of some Muslims?